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Here's the main difference in music licensing

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is you're like, okay, what TV show is it?

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What Netflix show is like,

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you have to stop focusing on those.

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Those are not a big deal anymore.

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Yeah, cool, getting an Audi commercial

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or an Apple commercial, great,

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but how many Apple commercials are there?

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Not many.

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How many YouTubers are there?

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Hundreds of millions.

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So the main difference is each individual placement

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pays less, but the pie is so much larger.

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So you just need to get a cut of that pie.

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What's going on everybody?

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This is the Cutting Through podcast

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where we help entrepreneurs and entertainers

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cut through the noise and more importantly,

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cut through the bullshit that they see online.

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My name is Elliot Towsley and I am your host.

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What's going on everybody?

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My name is Elliot.

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I am with my boy, Mark Eckert.

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What's up, dude?

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Is that the first time I've actually said

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your last name out loud to you, is that correct?

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Most people say Eckhart.

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Eckhart.

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Because that seems to be the more common name.

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We are one letter away from Eckert's drug empire.

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Apparently my family did not luck out, so son of a bitch.

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But yeah, that's it, Mark Eckert, dude, you got it right.

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I like it.

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Founder of that playlist, that pitch,

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and many other things that I can't even

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keep track of right now.

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But what we're gonna do here is,

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we've got about 15 or 20 minutes,

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and a lot of our audience is independent artists

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who are looking to figure out

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how to make it in the music industry.

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And if you don't mind, can we start with a brief background

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as to how you got into that pitch?

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How you, what is sync, what are sync placements

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for someone who might just be getting started?

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And what does the landscape of this area

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in the music business look like for,

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with everything, as much streaming content

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as there is on Netflix, Amazon, Prime, everything.

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Content is everywhere.

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Many opportunities for placements in these programs.

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So turn it over to you.

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Can you tell us a little bit about that pitch?

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What a guy, what an intro, dude.

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Yeah, so I started out primarily producing.

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So, you know, kind of like in the early days of Instagram.

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Well, okay, firstly, I went to school in Boston,

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moved to New York, and then I moved back

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to Charlotte, North Carolina,

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where we are currently, where we are.

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And I kind of just wanted to start producing full-time.

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I had been working in studios and stuff,

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and I was playing drums with a couple artists.

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I produced their records,

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and I started posting a bunch of stuff online

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of me producing, and then that kind of led

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to a bunch of people on Instagram,

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early days of Instagram, people reaching out.

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Hey, can you produce my record?

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I was like, hell yeah, I'm happy to work on it.

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So that kind of led to me producing a bunch of artists,

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both in America, and then I would tour to Australia,

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producing, drumming for a couple artists, Italy.

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And I primarily produced indie pop and hip hop records.

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Got really kind of busy in that,

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and I was working with five to 10 artists a month.

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It was really great.

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We came out with some awesome records I was really proud of.

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And then during that time, I talked to a good friend of mine,

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Charlotte Henson.

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She worked at Downtown Music in Amsterdam,

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and now she actually is head of sync licensing

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at Domino Publishing.

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So she does everything for Arctic Monkeys.

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Any massive UK artist, she's doing all the sync deals for,

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which is just totally badass.

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She's a gem, I love her.

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But she reached out to me, and she was like,

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hey, you work with a bunch of indie pop artists.

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That's your thing.

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They're all independent?

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And I was like, yeah.

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She's like, in her mind, she was like,

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oh, they're independent.

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They're not with a label or a publisher.

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It means that legally, they own all of the material.

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So it's going to be, from a legal perspective,

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very easy for somebody to sign a deal with,

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because the premise is one person gets to sign off for it.

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It's like, yep, you're allowed to use this.

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Do we need any other permissions?

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No, you're allowed to use this.

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So that's what she was looking at.

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And she was like, well,

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you should probably start getting into that.

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So started reaching out to a bunch of people,

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and more people started reaching out to me in sync.

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Word kind of got around.

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Everybody was hitting me up for indie pop gigs

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and indie pop tracks for specific deals.

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I started getting pretty busy with sync,

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and we landed a couple deals.

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And I figured out, after a specific deal that I landed,

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after everybody got paid,

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all of the middlemen and everything,

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I got like 25% or so of the full budget.

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Of that, I had to pay everybody else.

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And I was like, well, this is kind of fucked up.

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That's not cool.

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And I asked a bunch of my friends,

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and I was like, is this normal?

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As simple as that.

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And they were like, yep.

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So congratulations, man.

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You just, it's kind of like-

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You learned the game.

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Yeah, it's like when you play your first gig

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and you fuck up on stage,

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and you learn after time, nobody knows your parts.

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So you learn to just laugh or keep it cool

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and nobody notices.

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But as soon as you're like,

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oh my God, I played the wrong note,

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you let everybody know, they know you fucked up.

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So I went through my, I realized I fucked up.

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And so I was like, okay, well,

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this is just kind of how it works.

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Well, that's kind of annoying.

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Well, anyways, I started getting a bunch of these gigs.

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And at a certain point, people were like,

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do you have any stuff other than indie pop?

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Do you have country, hip hop, other shit?

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And so sometimes I had music, but a lot of times I didn't.

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So I hit up all my friends,

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and just like everybody in the music industry

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who has like a long-term career,

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they always say, focus on your relationships.

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Just build a long-term relationship.

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And that's what I did.

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I realized that, hey, these people are reaching out to me.

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They trust me.

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I gotta just show up.

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That's the most important thing is just show up.

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And so they would hit me up needing a track.

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If I didn't have anything, I would hit up one of my friends.

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Hey, do you have a track for this sort of thing?

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If you landed, I'll let you keep it 100%.

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I don't care.

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I wanna build this relationship.

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Right, right, yep, that makes sense.

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And I just kept doing that.

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And there was a time where I didn't have anything

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and all my friends didn't have anything.

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So I just posted it in Facebook,

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actually on Make Pop Music, which is a Facebook group

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that I'm a moderator in.

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Shout out to Austin Hull, who owns that group, awesome dude.

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And I posted the opportunity in there,

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and there were like 200 people or something

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that were like, I have a track for this.

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And I realized at that point,

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there's a lot of people who want to be active in this.

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Oh yeah, they don't even know.

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And the hard part is getting connected with somebody

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who has kind of built trust with those relationships.

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And I wanna premise the reason why the trust factor

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is so difficult is because if you send music

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that is not legally cleared,

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not only can you potentially cause a lawsuit,

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you could literally ruin someone's career.

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If you work with a music supervisor

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or a licensing company or whatever,

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you send something that you said was yours and it wasn't,

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they will never work with you again

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because it caused them issues

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and they maybe lost a client.

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You know? Yep.

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So anyways, I realized all these people wanted help.

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I had, you know, these relationships.

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And at the same time, I was like,

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I wanna see if there's a way

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where I can stop getting screwed from deals

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and all of my friends can stop getting screwed.

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And so I literally just built a paid email list.

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I was like, if we can cover rent essentially

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by building out all this stuff

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and doing the compliance for these deals,

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then I'm cool with that.

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And we were profitable within the first month.

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I kind of just let everybody know my intentions.

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Not, you know, I just wanna help.

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And it's grown from there.

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Four years later, now we're supplying

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the vast majority of music

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in the biggest licensing companies in the world

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and a bunch of different ad agencies.

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So I'm really proud of it.

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We have an awesome roster of producers and artists

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all around the world and we're still paying out 100%.

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So it's really cool.

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Hell yeah, that's awesome.

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So it's crazy.

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These people that you knew in the industry

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knew that you worked with a handful of particular artists

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or artists in a particular niche.

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In this case, the niche being independent artists,

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not necessarily the genre of the music in a way, right?

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Yeah, I mean, it was partially the genre.

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I think that's how I first got in,

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but then it really kind of just said,

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they were like, oh, you just know

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independent artists in general.

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Right, and that's easier for us.

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And then, so this group of people come to you,

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they know you have a network,

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and then you kind of recognized a business opportunity

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in what they were asking you.

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Yeah, I think, I mean, you probably would agree with this

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is business, like a lot of people in music

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think that business is like this icky tacky word,

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like, oh, fuck capitalists.

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No, it's like business is literally,

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there's a bad way to do business,

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but those people don't last in our industry.

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People who have good businesses

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are literally just solving a problem for people.

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Exactly. That's it.

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If you look at it from, how can I help someone,

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you're gonna have a thriving business.

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If you look at it from a place of, fuck you, pay me,

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then you're not gonna last very long, you know?

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So I was kind of just like, oh, this is a way

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where I can help a lot more people, you know,

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find more success, make some money.

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Yeah.

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At the beginning, did you think, oh, this is a way, like,

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I might be able, because at first I'm wondering,

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were you immediately thinking of,

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I can help a bunch of other artists,

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or were you like, wow, I know a lot of artists,

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I can help these people with their initial problem,

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and then the pendulum kind of swings back,

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and you're like, wait a minute, now there's,

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there are a bunch of these opportunities

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and a bunch of independent artists who are interested.

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It's interesting, because I think it was a mix.

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On one hand, these supervisors or connections

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or licensing agents, creative directors,

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they were reaching out to me, and I was like,

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I really wanna make sure I feed this relationship.

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Yeah, it's like, just show up, you know?

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At the same time, I had artists that I was producing

263
00:10:55,620 --> 00:10:58,020
that they were like, okay, so I know about

264
00:10:58,020 --> 00:11:00,620
a release strategy, like, I know how to put something out.

265
00:11:00,620 --> 00:11:03,180
I know different companies to work with,

266
00:11:03,180 --> 00:11:04,940
companies to stay away from, companies that are

267
00:11:04,940 --> 00:11:06,900
actually gonna help me, how can I go about

268
00:11:06,900 --> 00:11:09,140
playlisting, running ads, blah, blah, blah.

269
00:11:09,140 --> 00:11:10,620
Well, how do we get into licensing?

270
00:11:10,620 --> 00:11:11,740
What is publishing?

271
00:11:11,740 --> 00:11:13,540
How do I understand all this stuff?

272
00:11:13,540 --> 00:11:15,820
And I was just thinking, this could be

273
00:11:15,820 --> 00:11:17,980
another way to help them.

274
00:11:17,980 --> 00:11:22,980
By proxy, I had a huge network of friends

275
00:11:23,140 --> 00:11:26,740
who also made music in Facebook groups, Instagram, online,

276
00:11:26,740 --> 00:11:30,780
and I kind of realized I had already built trust

277
00:11:30,780 --> 00:11:34,180
with a community that I love, and that's the hardest

278
00:11:34,180 --> 00:11:36,220
thing to get, it's like, just trust.

279
00:11:36,220 --> 00:11:38,220
Hey, I'm not gonna screw you over,

280
00:11:38,220 --> 00:11:41,900
I'm really trying here, it's a balance.

281
00:11:41,900 --> 00:11:44,220
They gotta make money, I want you to make money,

282
00:11:44,220 --> 00:11:46,140
let's just make this thing work,

283
00:11:46,140 --> 00:11:47,980
and think of a long-term strategy

284
00:11:47,980 --> 00:11:49,420
so we can kind of change some things

285
00:11:49,420 --> 00:11:51,180
in the industry for everybody.

286
00:11:52,140 --> 00:11:55,260
But yeah, I think the main thing was like,

287
00:11:55,260 --> 00:11:58,740
I don't think it was like one side or the other, you know?

288
00:11:58,740 --> 00:12:01,980
It was really just like, hey, if they are reaching out

289
00:12:01,980 --> 00:12:04,820
to me and they're like, hey, Mark,

290
00:12:04,820 --> 00:12:08,020
I'm going to put my career on the line

291
00:12:08,020 --> 00:12:13,020
by saying I trust you, what a fucking compliment, man.

292
00:12:13,300 --> 00:12:17,980
Like, you're dealing with an Apple commercial for 40K,

293
00:12:17,980 --> 00:12:20,340
you're dealing with all this shit,

294
00:12:20,340 --> 00:12:22,140
and you're reaching out to me saying,

295
00:12:22,140 --> 00:12:25,620
hey man, I trust you that you're not gonna cause

296
00:12:25,620 --> 00:12:27,660
a legal issue for us.

297
00:12:27,660 --> 00:12:31,380
Oh my God, and it wasn't, I didn't really have much

298
00:12:31,380 --> 00:12:34,180
experience in it, but they just, I guess, knew my character

299
00:12:34,180 --> 00:12:35,940
of like, I'm gonna do everything I can

300
00:12:35,940 --> 00:12:38,780
to make sure you're not, you don't regret this,

301
00:12:38,780 --> 00:12:41,100
I'm gonna take care of you, because I genuinely know

302
00:12:41,100 --> 00:12:42,660
that you worked your ass off to be where you are,

303
00:12:42,660 --> 00:12:44,620
and I respect that, you know?

304
00:12:44,620 --> 00:12:46,380
So it was a way to help them, it was a way to help

305
00:12:46,380 --> 00:12:48,340
the artists I was producing and developing,

306
00:12:48,340 --> 00:12:50,260
it was a way to help all of my friends.

307
00:12:50,260 --> 00:12:53,740
So it was really just like, wow, I can really kind of help

308
00:12:53,740 --> 00:12:57,180
everybody help each other, and what a cool situation

309
00:12:57,180 --> 00:12:58,380
that could be, you know?

310
00:12:59,580 --> 00:13:02,300
Yeah, I think that was kind of the main premise, you know?

311
00:13:02,300 --> 00:13:06,020
Would you kind of like agree with that on, you know,

312
00:13:06,020 --> 00:13:09,260
from a marketing perspective, PR, you know,

313
00:13:09,260 --> 00:13:10,700
everybody's trying to tell their stories,

314
00:13:10,700 --> 00:13:12,860
that's kind of how I've always approached things.

315
00:13:12,860 --> 00:13:16,580
Yeah, yeah, I think a lot of companies,

316
00:13:16,580 --> 00:13:18,820
you were alluding to this, like the companies

317
00:13:18,820 --> 00:13:23,620
that are actually trying to help, yes, they are a company,

318
00:13:23,620 --> 00:13:25,580
yes, their intention is to make money,

319
00:13:25,580 --> 00:13:28,740
but they understand that the more they help,

320
00:13:28,740 --> 00:13:31,820
the more money they'll make, or the longer

321
00:13:31,820 --> 00:13:33,540
they'll be in the game.

322
00:13:33,540 --> 00:13:35,340
I think the thing is you can make short money,

323
00:13:35,340 --> 00:13:36,300
or you can make long money.

324
00:13:36,300 --> 00:13:39,100
Exactly, so I think like, exactly, there's people

325
00:13:39,100 --> 00:13:42,980
who recognize an opportunity to get theirs and get out,

326
00:13:42,980 --> 00:13:46,300
and they don't necessarily care who gets burnt in the way,

327
00:13:46,300 --> 00:13:47,740
or along the way, and then there's others

328
00:13:47,740 --> 00:13:50,980
that recognize an opportunity to help,

329
00:13:50,980 --> 00:13:52,860
is an opportunity to make money.

330
00:13:52,860 --> 00:13:53,700
Yeah.

331
00:13:53,700 --> 00:13:56,100
And helping, and an opportunity to like,

332
00:13:56,100 --> 00:13:58,660
get yours is different.

333
00:13:58,660 --> 00:14:01,100
Yeah, and I think, you know, also,

334
00:14:01,100 --> 00:14:02,620
specifically in the past couple years,

335
00:14:02,620 --> 00:14:05,500
there's been a lot of things that have popped up

336
00:14:05,500 --> 00:14:07,500
that have made people like, hesitant

337
00:14:07,540 --> 00:14:09,340
on like, different offers and stuff,

338
00:14:09,340 --> 00:14:12,220
and like, rightfully, you should be, you know?

339
00:14:12,220 --> 00:14:14,380
But again, it's like, you kind of go back to,

340
00:14:14,380 --> 00:14:17,020
there's people who understand these short-term gains,

341
00:14:17,020 --> 00:14:20,980
people who really believe in the long-term gains of things.

342
00:14:20,980 --> 00:14:23,460
So if you can find those companies, those people

343
00:14:23,460 --> 00:14:25,460
who believe in kind of long-term strategy

344
00:14:25,460 --> 00:14:29,300
of like, overall mission to, and you can see,

345
00:14:29,300 --> 00:14:32,060
like, they'll show you their cards, you know?

346
00:14:32,060 --> 00:14:34,260
You look in a little bit, they'll show you their cards.

347
00:14:34,260 --> 00:14:35,100
Oh yeah.

348
00:14:35,820 --> 00:14:38,380
It's not hard to decipher that sort of stuff.

349
00:14:38,380 --> 00:14:40,500
But if you see the companies that are really going at it

350
00:14:40,500 --> 00:14:41,900
from a long-term perspective,

351
00:14:41,900 --> 00:14:44,060
and they're thinking like, five years out,

352
00:14:44,060 --> 00:14:47,140
those are typically the ones that you want to get in with.

353
00:14:47,140 --> 00:14:50,260
Because there's a lot more companies and offers coming out,

354
00:14:50,260 --> 00:14:52,420
and it's amazing how democratized it's been,

355
00:14:52,420 --> 00:14:55,660
but with that, you know, you want to have a trained eye,

356
00:14:55,660 --> 00:14:56,500
you know?

357
00:14:56,500 --> 00:14:58,900
Well, especially in music, where it seems like

358
00:14:58,900 --> 00:15:03,860
so many companies that were started yesterday,

359
00:15:03,860 --> 00:15:08,540
all of a sudden have like a new secret way to success

360
00:15:08,540 --> 00:15:10,180
that no one's ever seen before.

361
00:15:10,180 --> 00:15:11,020
Yeah.

362
00:15:11,020 --> 00:15:13,620
And I think now it's not every new company,

363
00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:15,540
because you were a new company at one point,

364
00:15:15,540 --> 00:15:18,140
and we were a new company, but especially in music,

365
00:15:18,140 --> 00:15:21,380
it just seems that company started yesterday

366
00:15:21,380 --> 00:15:25,100
called like musicindustryexperts.com,

367
00:15:25,100 --> 00:15:28,900
and you know, they've got some makeshift website

368
00:15:28,900 --> 00:15:32,180
and some Instagram page with, you know,

369
00:15:32,220 --> 00:15:34,340
200 fake followers on it,

370
00:15:34,340 --> 00:15:37,900
and offering some sort of bullshit secret.

371
00:15:37,900 --> 00:15:38,740
Yeah.

372
00:15:38,740 --> 00:15:41,700
There's the music industry since,

373
00:15:41,700 --> 00:15:45,820
like the modern music industry forever has been a situation

374
00:15:45,820 --> 00:15:50,660
where people have seen the people making this content,

375
00:15:50,660 --> 00:15:54,980
or making the, you know, that have the attention,

376
00:15:54,980 --> 00:15:59,060
that have the audience, and just taking advantage of them.

377
00:15:59,060 --> 00:16:02,140
But you know, back, it was for years,

378
00:16:03,140 --> 00:16:05,060
so everyone as an artist, I think,

379
00:16:05,060 --> 00:16:08,740
is programmed to think that someone somewhere

380
00:16:08,740 --> 00:16:11,340
at the record label, or at this sync company,

381
00:16:11,340 --> 00:16:14,100
or they're all trying to take advantage of me,

382
00:16:14,100 --> 00:16:15,540
and I have my guard up.

383
00:16:15,540 --> 00:16:18,220
I can tell you for a fact, just, you know,

384
00:16:18,220 --> 00:16:19,780
this is not a name dropping situation,

385
00:16:19,780 --> 00:16:22,140
but I am literally just saying it from a perspective

386
00:16:22,140 --> 00:16:24,700
of logistics within the music industry

387
00:16:24,700 --> 00:16:26,900
of the gatekeepers, so to speak.

388
00:16:26,900 --> 00:16:30,780
So I worked on a couple big records, you know,

389
00:16:30,780 --> 00:16:35,420
for Joji, Future, to Baby, Lil Baby,

390
00:16:35,420 --> 00:16:38,940
and you know, I have some plaques, okay, very cool.

391
00:16:38,940 --> 00:16:40,020
It really doesn't mean anything,

392
00:16:40,020 --> 00:16:42,940
but I love a good painting on a wall.

393
00:16:42,940 --> 00:16:44,660
Why not stick some other artwork?

394
00:16:44,660 --> 00:16:47,940
Anyways, you know, getting them is just a matter

395
00:16:47,940 --> 00:16:51,060
of so many logistics of, you know, proving, you know,

396
00:16:51,060 --> 00:16:54,220
that you're on the record, who was the A&R on it,

397
00:16:54,220 --> 00:16:55,700
then they need approval from this person,

398
00:16:55,700 --> 00:16:57,220
then you need approval from that person,

399
00:16:57,220 --> 00:16:59,740
and then you have this person that gives the final sendoff.

400
00:16:59,740 --> 00:17:01,020
Once they give the final sendoff,

401
00:17:01,020 --> 00:17:03,460
then the companies actually make the plaque,

402
00:17:03,460 --> 00:17:04,700
needs another addition.

403
00:17:04,700 --> 00:17:07,300
It's just so annoying, and when you realize

404
00:17:07,300 --> 00:17:09,860
that everything in the music, and like,

405
00:17:09,860 --> 00:17:12,420
people always talk about overnight success,

406
00:17:12,420 --> 00:17:16,500
but the way that I, there was a book I read years ago

407
00:17:16,500 --> 00:17:18,460
by Chris Golbo, and it was called

408
00:17:18,460 --> 00:17:20,540
365 Days to Overnight Success.

409
00:17:20,540 --> 00:17:24,620
I love that premise, because when you realize

410
00:17:24,620 --> 00:17:28,180
that nothing, you're really just laying brick.

411
00:17:28,580 --> 00:17:32,540
There are no moments, I don't know for you,

412
00:17:32,540 --> 00:17:34,540
you know, if you've had these moments,

413
00:17:34,540 --> 00:17:39,540
please, come out with a $10,000 guru, I will pay you.

414
00:17:39,900 --> 00:17:41,980
I personally have not had any moments

415
00:17:41,980 --> 00:17:44,740
where I was like, I've made it, you know?

416
00:17:44,740 --> 00:17:47,540
Yeah, we work with huge licensing companies,

417
00:17:47,540 --> 00:17:50,660
and labels, and publishers to do all these deals,

418
00:17:50,660 --> 00:17:52,060
but it's always laying brick.

419
00:17:52,060 --> 00:17:54,380
It's like, okay, this is the next step there.

420
00:17:54,380 --> 00:17:56,220
At a meeting, I'd talk to you about a company

421
00:17:56,220 --> 00:17:57,700
that I was talking with this morning.

422
00:17:57,700 --> 00:18:00,140
Awesome company, I've wanted to work with them for years.

423
00:18:00,140 --> 00:18:01,220
You know, it was an hour long meeting.

424
00:18:01,220 --> 00:18:02,900
I was like, great, this is a great step

425
00:18:02,900 --> 00:18:05,380
in the right direction, you know what I'm saying?

426
00:18:05,380 --> 00:18:07,780
But yeah, once you realize that everything

427
00:18:07,780 --> 00:18:09,740
is kind of just step by step,

428
00:18:09,740 --> 00:18:12,060
and it's a lot of just grunt work,

429
00:18:12,060 --> 00:18:15,060
the best way to explain it, in all actuality,

430
00:18:15,060 --> 00:18:18,460
like the best metaphor, is if you think about the internet,

431
00:18:18,460 --> 00:18:20,380
okay, I think I talked to you about this recently,

432
00:18:20,380 --> 00:18:21,860
but you think about the internet,

433
00:18:21,860 --> 00:18:23,980
you're like, oh, it's this magical thing.

434
00:18:23,980 --> 00:18:25,740
You know, it's like, oh, there's probably like,

435
00:18:25,780 --> 00:18:29,140
super high tech, like, you know, satellites,

436
00:18:29,140 --> 00:18:30,900
and like all this stuff that like powers it,

437
00:18:30,900 --> 00:18:32,980
and connects everybody around the world.

438
00:18:32,980 --> 00:18:35,700
And then you look up, how does the internet work?

439
00:18:36,540 --> 00:18:40,980
They literally laid cable through the Atlantic Ocean,

440
00:18:40,980 --> 00:18:43,500
and Pacific, and connected all these islands

441
00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:46,860
through cables, that's it, that's how they did it.

442
00:18:46,860 --> 00:18:49,100
So like, you know, when everyone is like,

443
00:18:49,100 --> 00:18:50,940
yeah, I really wanna like, you know,

444
00:18:50,940 --> 00:18:53,380
telegraph my homie back in the UK, you know,

445
00:18:53,380 --> 00:18:55,300
and they're in the 13, well, no, it's not that old,

446
00:18:55,300 --> 00:19:00,300
but they're, my homie, they're pilgrims.

447
00:19:00,300 --> 00:19:04,060
But, you know, they were literally just like,

448
00:19:05,220 --> 00:19:09,100
well Chuck, that internet, or excuse me,

449
00:19:09,100 --> 00:19:11,340
that electric cable connected over here,

450
00:19:11,340 --> 00:19:14,700
connected that lamp, why don't we just make it longer?

451
00:19:14,700 --> 00:19:17,940
And they were like, fuck out of here, you get out of here.

452
00:19:17,940 --> 00:19:19,740
And then everyone else was like,

453
00:19:19,740 --> 00:19:23,060
oh wow, I think that's the way it's gonna work.

454
00:19:23,060 --> 00:19:25,420
And so they just made a long cable

455
00:19:26,460 --> 00:19:30,380
from the US to the UK, and that was it.

456
00:19:30,380 --> 00:19:32,820
That is the industry, that is the music industry,

457
00:19:32,820 --> 00:19:36,500
is literally, it's just rudimentary solutions

458
00:19:36,500 --> 00:19:39,580
to what you probably think is a really complex problem.

459
00:19:39,580 --> 00:19:41,780
The way that we do all of our copyright agreements

460
00:19:41,780 --> 00:19:43,980
and licensing infrastructure and all this stuff

461
00:19:43,980 --> 00:19:46,740
is just a bunch of really, really, really,

462
00:19:46,740 --> 00:19:49,340
really annoying automations that we built out

463
00:19:49,340 --> 00:19:52,300
over the past four years that, you know, at this time,

464
00:19:52,300 --> 00:19:55,380
I think, you know, it's the 20th of the month or whatever,

465
00:19:55,380 --> 00:19:56,500
we've done like, you know,

466
00:19:56,500 --> 00:19:59,940
close to 100,000 automations this month.

467
00:19:59,940 --> 00:20:01,380
Yeah, it's dumb, it's dumb,

468
00:20:01,380 --> 00:20:03,820
but that's the only way we can do it, you know?

469
00:20:03,820 --> 00:20:05,620
And I didn't know how to automate anything,

470
00:20:05,620 --> 00:20:08,020
so I learned, I just Googled.

471
00:20:08,020 --> 00:20:11,020
And it's just a bunch of annoying little things.

472
00:20:11,020 --> 00:20:15,460
You lay brick, stop trying to make a million dollars tonight,

473
00:20:15,460 --> 00:20:18,340
get a Grammy, why don't you just focus

474
00:20:18,340 --> 00:20:21,020
on getting a thousand more plays this month

475
00:20:21,020 --> 00:20:22,700
than you got last month?

476
00:20:22,700 --> 00:20:25,740
You do that over the course of a year.

477
00:20:25,740 --> 00:20:29,180
Wow, now you have a lot more plays

478
00:20:29,180 --> 00:20:30,740
and it's growing and growing.

479
00:20:30,740 --> 00:20:32,500
Right, and it's a system.

480
00:20:32,500 --> 00:20:35,780
Yeah, people won't look at the next step, you know?

481
00:20:35,780 --> 00:20:36,620
It's annoying.

482
00:20:36,620 --> 00:20:41,620
I think a lot of people, you're right,

483
00:21:00,580 --> 00:21:02,460
they are looking for that moment where you're like,

484
00:21:02,460 --> 00:21:04,700
oh wow, I made it, like Drake retweeted me

485
00:21:04,700 --> 00:21:07,140
and I went from 900 monthly listeners

486
00:21:07,140 --> 00:21:09,980
to 850,000 in one day.

487
00:21:09,980 --> 00:21:10,820
Yeah.

488
00:21:10,820 --> 00:21:14,380
And like, that might be possible.

489
00:21:14,380 --> 00:21:15,220
Sure. It might be.

490
00:21:15,220 --> 00:21:16,220
It's not impossible.

491
00:21:16,220 --> 00:21:18,180
I don't know, if Barack Obama tweeted you

492
00:21:18,180 --> 00:21:21,220
and 50 Cent came out and did a parody, who knows?

493
00:21:21,220 --> 00:21:22,740
A lot of weird shit could happen.

494
00:21:22,740 --> 00:21:23,980
Yeah.

495
00:21:23,980 --> 00:21:27,100
But so many people are focused on catching lightning

496
00:21:27,100 --> 00:21:29,900
in a bottle, they're not focused on laying the brick.

497
00:21:29,900 --> 00:21:31,740
You're never going to be in a situation

498
00:21:31,740 --> 00:21:33,460
where you're like, okay, I'm good forever.

499
00:21:33,460 --> 00:21:36,060
Because if you're like me, neurotic,

500
00:21:36,060 --> 00:21:38,580
and you always want to grow and you're just like,

501
00:21:38,580 --> 00:21:41,540
I'm unsatisfied, you're going to constantly want to grow.

502
00:21:41,540 --> 00:21:44,620
Because let's say you get, I mean,

503
00:21:44,620 --> 00:21:47,020
I don't even know how people calculate success.

504
00:21:47,020 --> 00:21:48,220
Everybody thinks it's like followers.

505
00:21:48,220 --> 00:21:50,660
I'm just like, do you have money in your bank account?

506
00:21:50,660 --> 00:21:53,460
How, I think success is, is like,

507
00:21:53,460 --> 00:21:55,500
how long are you not worried about rent

508
00:21:55,500 --> 00:21:57,180
and are you enjoying the people around you

509
00:21:57,180 --> 00:21:58,340
and the music you're making?

510
00:21:58,340 --> 00:21:59,180
Right.

511
00:21:59,180 --> 00:22:00,380
You know?

512
00:22:00,380 --> 00:22:02,860
I think that's actually what I equate.

513
00:22:02,860 --> 00:22:05,820
Like that and the ability to travel and freedom

514
00:22:05,820 --> 00:22:08,060
and just make music with the people you like,

515
00:22:08,060 --> 00:22:10,100
travel, eat good food.

516
00:22:10,100 --> 00:22:12,900
If you can do that and not worry, you've made it.

517
00:22:12,900 --> 00:22:15,540
Like what else you, I don't know what other goals

518
00:22:15,540 --> 00:22:17,180
other people have, but those are my goals.

519
00:22:17,180 --> 00:22:18,300
That's about it.

520
00:22:18,300 --> 00:22:19,140
You know?

521
00:22:19,140 --> 00:22:21,540
Well, so how does an artist get involved with that pitch?

522
00:22:21,540 --> 00:22:24,860
Like, do they just sign up and pitch their songs?

523
00:22:24,860 --> 00:22:26,900
It's literally that simple.

524
00:22:26,900 --> 00:22:29,300
So you literally sign up,

525
00:22:29,300 --> 00:22:31,780
the way we do it is there's a membership fee.

526
00:22:31,780 --> 00:22:35,180
You pay that membership and then we don't take

527
00:22:35,180 --> 00:22:37,100
all of your money when you land something.

528
00:22:37,100 --> 00:22:37,940
And that's it.

529
00:22:37,940 --> 00:22:39,900
You just upload your catalog of music.

530
00:22:39,900 --> 00:22:41,740
We send it to all the companies that we work with

531
00:22:41,740 --> 00:22:44,060
and we land hundreds of deals every single month.

532
00:22:44,060 --> 00:22:45,420
Everything's automated.

533
00:22:45,420 --> 00:22:46,900
You just upload your stuff.

534
00:22:46,900 --> 00:22:48,940
These companies are, I want that beep-bop-boop.

535
00:22:48,940 --> 00:22:50,420
I want this, I want that.

536
00:22:50,420 --> 00:22:52,340
And then you're notified.

537
00:22:52,340 --> 00:22:54,860
And then you just provide like the,

538
00:22:54,860 --> 00:22:56,220
the stuff that they need,

539
00:22:56,220 --> 00:22:58,300
which is like stems or whatever

540
00:22:58,300 --> 00:23:00,500
that they need for their platform

541
00:23:00,500 --> 00:23:03,420
or the ad that they're working on.

542
00:23:03,420 --> 00:23:04,260
And that's it.

543
00:23:04,260 --> 00:23:05,100
And then you get paid.

544
00:23:05,100 --> 00:23:06,180
It's literally that simple.

545
00:23:06,180 --> 00:23:09,540
It's like just distributing your music into Spotify.

546
00:23:09,540 --> 00:23:11,900
Imagine distributing your music into all these deals.

547
00:23:11,900 --> 00:23:12,860
That's what we do.

548
00:23:14,100 --> 00:23:15,820
So yeah, I thought we could make it simple.

549
00:23:15,820 --> 00:23:17,060
And I think we've done that.

550
00:23:17,060 --> 00:23:17,900
Hell yeah.

551
00:23:17,900 --> 00:23:21,740
And now you said artists at this point,

552
00:23:21,740 --> 00:23:25,660
they can only give music that is not released yet, right?

553
00:23:25,660 --> 00:23:30,100
What a great way to potentially build a shit ton

554
00:23:30,100 --> 00:23:31,660
of momentum for the release of a song.

555
00:23:31,660 --> 00:23:32,500
Exactly.

556
00:23:32,500 --> 00:23:35,460
So that's kind of how we approached it is,

557
00:23:36,500 --> 00:23:37,940
from a compliance perspective,

558
00:23:37,940 --> 00:23:40,060
it's easier if it's unreleased and unregistered

559
00:23:40,060 --> 00:23:40,940
at the start.

560
00:23:42,020 --> 00:23:44,060
But as soon as the song comes out,

561
00:23:44,060 --> 00:23:46,660
because most of these tracks end up being released,

562
00:23:46,660 --> 00:23:48,180
there's already a marketing engine behind it.

563
00:23:48,180 --> 00:23:50,020
So if you release any of your other stuff,

564
00:23:50,020 --> 00:23:51,500
you own your artist profile.

565
00:23:51,500 --> 00:23:52,900
So it's pretty badass.

566
00:23:52,900 --> 00:23:55,020
We primarily are working with producers right now

567
00:23:55,020 --> 00:23:57,140
because they just have a bunch of unreleased stuff

568
00:23:57,140 --> 00:23:58,060
just sitting on your hard drive.

569
00:23:58,060 --> 00:24:00,060
So it's like, hey, I have like all these demos.

570
00:24:01,020 --> 00:24:02,140
I'm going to upload all my demos.

571
00:24:02,140 --> 00:24:04,940
And then all of a sudden you make tens of thousands

572
00:24:04,940 --> 00:24:07,140
of dollars from just stuff that you had lying around.

573
00:24:07,140 --> 00:24:08,980
It's like, sick.

574
00:24:08,980 --> 00:24:12,500
I will say later this year, a big focus of us,

575
00:24:12,500 --> 00:24:14,700
we actually have a couple of things in a pipeline,

576
00:24:14,700 --> 00:24:15,780
which I'm very excited about,

577
00:24:15,780 --> 00:24:20,060
which is going to be literally the best licensing experience

578
00:24:20,060 --> 00:24:21,540
ever for artists.

579
00:24:21,540 --> 00:24:23,020
It's going to put so much power

580
00:24:23,020 --> 00:24:24,220
back into the independent industry.

581
00:24:24,220 --> 00:24:25,580
I'm so stoked.

582
00:24:25,580 --> 00:24:26,780
It's kind of the dream that I've had

583
00:24:26,780 --> 00:24:29,860
for the past couple of years, and we're almost there.

584
00:24:30,660 --> 00:24:31,740
Yeah, stay tuned with that.

585
00:24:31,740 --> 00:24:34,100
But if you're a producer or you have unreleased stuff

586
00:24:34,100 --> 00:24:36,580
on music or as an artist, go for it.

587
00:24:36,580 --> 00:24:38,180
And then your release stuff,

588
00:24:38,180 --> 00:24:42,500
we also do have a designated area for released music

589
00:24:42,500 --> 00:24:43,500
on our current platform.

590
00:24:43,500 --> 00:24:46,460
So yeah, whatever you do, if you make music,

591
00:24:46,460 --> 00:24:48,260
just we can help.

592
00:24:48,260 --> 00:24:49,460
So it's pretty cool.

593
00:24:49,460 --> 00:24:51,700
Yeah, well, I mean, I know there's a lot of artists

594
00:24:51,700 --> 00:24:54,220
hitting me up all the time asking about how to get

595
00:24:54,220 --> 00:24:55,940
their song into a Netflix show.

596
00:24:55,940 --> 00:24:57,020
Bro, hit me up.

597
00:24:57,020 --> 00:24:59,780
Cool thing is our team is like super chill

598
00:25:00,700 --> 00:25:01,820
and very accessible.

599
00:25:01,820 --> 00:25:06,260
Everybody there on our team, nicest people ever.

600
00:25:06,260 --> 00:25:07,860
And we're literally just normal.

601
00:25:07,860 --> 00:25:10,740
I make records.

602
00:25:10,740 --> 00:25:14,420
Our head of operations and head of A&R make records.

603
00:25:14,420 --> 00:25:16,620
All of our A&Rs are producers.

604
00:25:16,620 --> 00:25:20,660
So everybody on the team is also in licensing and publishing

605
00:25:20,660 --> 00:25:24,220
and actually making music, touring on music, et cetera.

606
00:25:24,220 --> 00:25:26,260
So everyone's just super chill.

607
00:25:26,260 --> 00:25:29,300
Cool thing is we also have a community online.

608
00:25:29,300 --> 00:25:32,140
So if you need any help, there's hundreds of people

609
00:25:32,140 --> 00:25:34,220
that are just like, yeah, this is how to do it.

610
00:25:34,220 --> 00:25:36,260
So it's pretty chill, pretty cool.

611
00:25:36,260 --> 00:25:39,620
One question that I, so you mainly work with producers.

612
00:25:39,620 --> 00:25:42,540
Someone's up and coming in their production

613
00:25:43,460 --> 00:25:45,780
and they're trying to be proactive

614
00:25:45,780 --> 00:25:48,660
where they think like this industry is going.

615
00:25:48,660 --> 00:25:52,220
Is there a particular sound or particular feel

616
00:25:52,220 --> 00:25:54,220
that you seem like, oh yeah,

617
00:25:54,220 --> 00:25:56,420
if you can make an eerie background noise

618
00:25:56,420 --> 00:25:57,420
for a horror movie.

619
00:25:57,420 --> 00:25:58,260
You know what's funny?

620
00:25:58,260 --> 00:26:00,540
We're licensing every single genre, every single month.

621
00:26:00,540 --> 00:26:01,820
It's insane.

622
00:26:01,820 --> 00:26:03,460
Just like, okay, how about this?

623
00:26:03,460 --> 00:26:06,700
Is it mostly what kind of things are you licensing?

624
00:26:06,700 --> 00:26:07,700
Is it commercials?

625
00:26:07,700 --> 00:26:10,740
Is it the background in a show and credits?

626
00:26:10,740 --> 00:26:13,140
There are seasonal changes.

627
00:26:13,140 --> 00:26:14,780
An easy way to explain it is like,

628
00:26:14,780 --> 00:26:18,140
okay, if the summer's coming up, the season before that,

629
00:26:18,140 --> 00:26:20,740
there's gonna be a bunch of tropical things that are needed

630
00:26:20,740 --> 00:26:22,820
because there's gonna be a bunch of ads

631
00:26:22,820 --> 00:26:25,660
for da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da.

632
00:26:25,660 --> 00:26:27,260
The Carnival Cruise thing.

633
00:26:27,260 --> 00:26:28,580
Well, there's a lot of other companies

634
00:26:28,580 --> 00:26:31,820
that don't wanna get that specific track.

635
00:26:31,820 --> 00:26:34,220
And so they need a bunch of stuff.

636
00:26:34,220 --> 00:26:38,020
But the main kind of thing is like,

637
00:26:38,020 --> 00:26:40,340
here's the main difference in music licensing

638
00:26:40,340 --> 00:26:42,100
is you're like, okay, what TV show is it?

639
00:26:42,100 --> 00:26:43,460
What Netflix show is like,

640
00:26:43,460 --> 00:26:46,220
you have to stop focusing on those.

641
00:26:46,220 --> 00:26:48,260
Those are not a big deal anymore.

642
00:26:48,260 --> 00:26:50,140
Yeah, cool, getting an Audi commercial

643
00:26:50,140 --> 00:26:52,220
or an Apple commercial, great.

644
00:26:52,220 --> 00:26:54,500
But how many Apple commercials are there?

645
00:26:54,500 --> 00:26:55,700
Not many.

646
00:26:55,700 --> 00:26:57,500
How many YouTubers are there?

647
00:26:57,500 --> 00:26:59,340
Hundreds of millions.

648
00:26:59,340 --> 00:27:04,340
So the main difference is each individual placement

649
00:27:04,580 --> 00:27:09,060
pays less, but the pie is so much larger.

650
00:27:09,060 --> 00:27:10,660
So you just need to get a cut of that pie.

651
00:27:10,660 --> 00:27:11,500
Yeah, okay.

652
00:27:11,500 --> 00:27:14,900
Like who cares about the $40,000 placement?

653
00:27:14,900 --> 00:27:17,580
Yeah, who cares about the $140,000 gig

654
00:27:17,580 --> 00:27:20,980
if there's $500, $400 gigs?

655
00:27:20,980 --> 00:27:22,620
That's what we're focused on.

656
00:27:22,620 --> 00:27:23,860
And while we do, you know,

657
00:27:23,860 --> 00:27:25,780
I just landed a Burberry commercial.

658
00:27:25,780 --> 00:27:27,620
We're working on a couple of, you know,

659
00:27:27,620 --> 00:27:28,900
the sexy stuff, you know, I love that.

660
00:27:28,900 --> 00:27:32,380
But you know, like all of the vloggers online,

661
00:27:32,380 --> 00:27:35,700
all of the podcasters, all of just the content creators,

662
00:27:35,700 --> 00:27:39,460
that is the next phase of music licensing.

663
00:27:39,460 --> 00:27:42,620
Yes, Netflix, Amazon, all these companies,

664
00:27:42,620 --> 00:27:44,060
by all means, they are pouring.

665
00:27:44,060 --> 00:27:44,900
Sexier.

666
00:27:44,900 --> 00:27:46,940
Yeah, and I'm not going to discredit them.

667
00:27:46,940 --> 00:27:51,740
They are pouring more money into film than ever before.

668
00:27:51,740 --> 00:27:54,980
I mean, Netflix, you want to talk about crazy stuff.

669
00:27:54,980 --> 00:27:58,340
Netflix recently, I read they opened up

670
00:27:58,340 --> 00:28:01,300
a film studio in Spain.

671
00:28:01,300 --> 00:28:03,500
And the general premise is,

672
00:28:03,500 --> 00:28:05,980
if you look at the creator economy as a whole

673
00:28:05,980 --> 00:28:07,820
of like where everything's moving,

674
00:28:07,820 --> 00:28:10,460
you know, music has always followed film, okay?

675
00:28:10,460 --> 00:28:13,260
Just our trends for consumer behavior, nerdy stuff,

676
00:28:13,260 --> 00:28:15,180
like it just follows film.

677
00:28:15,180 --> 00:28:17,620
Well, historically, all of the movie stars

678
00:28:17,620 --> 00:28:19,940
have been out of Hollywood, right?

679
00:28:20,020 --> 00:28:22,580
Well, that's because the creation of those films

680
00:28:22,580 --> 00:28:24,740
were in Hollywood, okay?

681
00:28:24,740 --> 00:28:28,020
Well, Netflix opened up a studio in Spain.

682
00:28:28,020 --> 00:28:31,700
And Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, they have data

683
00:28:31,700 --> 00:28:33,460
that Hollywood never had.

684
00:28:33,460 --> 00:28:35,340
They know who's listening, or excuse me,

685
00:28:35,340 --> 00:28:36,980
they know who's watching.

686
00:28:36,980 --> 00:28:38,780
They know where they're watching.

687
00:28:38,780 --> 00:28:41,300
They know what they do, okay?

688
00:28:41,300 --> 00:28:45,700
So the Brad Pitt's, the Jennifer Aniston's,

689
00:28:45,700 --> 00:28:49,980
that is going to be, in my view, less and less,

690
00:28:49,980 --> 00:28:52,700
and we're going to have a lot of regional stars.

691
00:28:52,700 --> 00:28:55,580
Because if you live in Romania,

692
00:28:55,580 --> 00:28:56,780
do you want to watch Brad Pitt,

693
00:28:56,780 --> 00:28:59,260
or do you want to watch the Brad Pitt in Romania?

694
00:28:59,260 --> 00:29:00,620
You might walk into him.

695
00:29:00,620 --> 00:29:01,460
How cool is that?

696
00:29:01,460 --> 00:29:02,660
Brad Pittif.

697
00:29:02,660 --> 00:29:03,660
Exactly.

698
00:29:04,900 --> 00:29:07,260
But seriously, it's like, you know,

699
00:29:07,260 --> 00:29:09,780
there's going to be a lot of regional talent.

700
00:29:09,780 --> 00:29:10,620
Yeah, that makes sense.

701
00:29:10,620 --> 00:29:12,220
And we're seeing that in the music industry.

702
00:29:12,220 --> 00:29:14,700
You know, Lizzo, Minneapolis.

703
00:29:14,700 --> 00:29:16,700
The baby, Charlotte.

704
00:29:16,700 --> 00:29:19,060
This is happening more and more and more.

705
00:29:19,060 --> 00:29:21,140
And everybody's looking at it, it's like,

706
00:29:21,140 --> 00:29:22,820
oh, you know, LA, New York, and Nashville,

707
00:29:22,820 --> 00:29:23,860
they're still the thing.

708
00:29:23,860 --> 00:29:25,020
London, still the thing.

709
00:29:25,020 --> 00:29:27,660
And of course, but if you look at,

710
00:29:27,660 --> 00:29:29,580
I mean, really think to yourself,

711
00:29:29,580 --> 00:29:31,780
and you're going to, if you're not lying to yourself,

712
00:29:31,780 --> 00:29:34,340
you're going to come up with the right answer here.

713
00:29:34,340 --> 00:29:39,100
If you compare the music-making creation,

714
00:29:39,100 --> 00:29:42,780
content creation population of New York, Nashville,

715
00:29:42,780 --> 00:29:47,780
LA, and London, in comparison to the music-making creation,

716
00:29:47,900 --> 00:29:51,260
you know, content creation, making creators

717
00:29:51,260 --> 00:29:52,780
of the rest of the world,

718
00:29:52,780 --> 00:29:55,300
what do you think's the bigger market?

719
00:29:55,300 --> 00:29:57,780
And do they have the same tools?

720
00:29:58,620 --> 00:30:00,460
Where is the future?

721
00:30:00,460 --> 00:30:05,460
Invest there, divest from before.

722
00:30:06,460 --> 00:30:08,180
That is what we're focused on,

723
00:30:08,180 --> 00:30:12,380
is our entire focus is the future of licensing

724
00:30:12,380 --> 00:30:13,780
and publishing.

725
00:30:13,780 --> 00:30:17,220
And a lot of like old school cats in the industry,

726
00:30:17,220 --> 00:30:19,140
you know, I've gotten some slack for that.

727
00:30:19,140 --> 00:30:22,140
And that's like, I understand, they're great people,

728
00:30:22,140 --> 00:30:24,660
you know, but like, at the end of the day,

729
00:30:24,660 --> 00:30:26,820
it's like, whether you like it or not,

730
00:30:26,820 --> 00:30:28,420
this is just where it's headed.

731
00:30:28,420 --> 00:30:31,860
If you look from a data and revenue perspective,

732
00:30:31,860 --> 00:30:34,500
there is a market that is growing,

733
00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:37,260
and there is a market that is dying.

734
00:30:37,260 --> 00:30:38,460
Right, it's peaked.

735
00:30:38,460 --> 00:30:40,780
It's peaked, and that's all you need to know.

736
00:30:40,780 --> 00:30:41,820
Go where the growth is,

737
00:30:41,820 --> 00:30:44,100
because the growth means there's cracks.

738
00:30:44,100 --> 00:30:46,940
And if there's cracks, that means you can get in.

739
00:30:46,940 --> 00:30:48,540
I'm not special, I'm an idiot,

740
00:30:48,540 --> 00:30:53,340
but I'm getting in with companies that have those cracks.

741
00:30:53,340 --> 00:30:55,380
They are the new industry,

742
00:30:55,380 --> 00:30:58,460
and that's where we're focused, is all the new industry.

743
00:30:58,460 --> 00:31:00,740
That's really, yeah, that's some good perspective.

744
00:31:00,740 --> 00:31:01,980
I think you're right.

745
00:31:01,980 --> 00:31:06,380
There are, stop thinking about catching the big whale,

746
00:31:06,380 --> 00:31:08,180
start catching a few fish.

747
00:31:08,180 --> 00:31:09,980
Not even fish, go after the kelp, bro.

748
00:31:09,980 --> 00:31:10,820
Yeah, right.

749
00:31:10,820 --> 00:31:11,660
There's a lot of them.

750
00:31:12,460 --> 00:31:13,300
Yeah, man.

751
00:31:13,300 --> 00:31:15,060
Yeah, there's a shit ton of shrimp, and I like shrimp.

752
00:31:15,060 --> 00:31:16,300
I love shrimp.

753
00:31:16,300 --> 00:31:17,700
I am a seafood eater.

754
00:31:17,700 --> 00:31:19,580
Okay, we'll come up to New England sometime.

755
00:31:19,580 --> 00:31:20,740
We'll show you some good lobster.

756
00:31:20,740 --> 00:31:21,580
Some chowder.

757
00:31:21,580 --> 00:31:22,420
Some chowder.

758
00:31:22,420 --> 00:31:23,620
I lived in Boston for a year.

759
00:31:23,620 --> 00:31:24,460
Oh, okay.

760
00:31:24,460 --> 00:31:25,860
So, familiar.

761
00:31:25,860 --> 00:31:28,140
And Connecticut, and New York.

762
00:31:28,140 --> 00:31:30,540
Well, New York's not New England, but anyways, chowder.

763
00:31:30,540 --> 00:31:31,380
Chowder.

764
00:31:31,380 --> 00:31:32,220
Chowder.

765
00:31:32,220 --> 00:31:33,420
So, cool.

766
00:31:33,420 --> 00:31:35,700
If you're a producer looking to get your songs,

767
00:31:35,700 --> 00:31:39,620
or your instrumentation, instrumentals, production,

768
00:31:39,620 --> 00:31:40,900
whatever you want to call it,

769
00:31:40,900 --> 00:31:42,220
look for some sink opportunities.

770
00:31:42,220 --> 00:31:44,020
Check out thatpitch.com.

771
00:31:44,020 --> 00:31:45,740
I'm here with Mark Eckert.

772
00:31:45,740 --> 00:31:46,580
That's a wrap.

773
00:31:48,580 --> 00:31:50,900
That does it for this episode

774
00:31:50,900 --> 00:31:53,260
of the Cutting Through Podcast.

775
00:31:53,260 --> 00:31:55,020
My name is Elliot Towsley.

776
00:31:55,020 --> 00:31:58,940
Thank you so much for tuning in and supporting the show.

777
00:31:58,940 --> 00:32:02,300
Believe it or not, aside from sending me money,

778
00:32:02,300 --> 00:32:04,900
the best way that you can support the show

779
00:32:04,900 --> 00:32:08,900
is by subscribing and rating the podcast

780
00:32:08,900 --> 00:32:11,700
on your favorite streaming platform.

781
00:32:11,700 --> 00:32:15,140
And send us your questions about what type of topics

782
00:32:15,140 --> 00:32:17,340
you would like us to cover next.

783
00:32:17,340 --> 00:32:19,060
My name is Elliot Towsley.

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You can find me on Instagram at Elliot.Towsley,

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or check out my company, De Novo Agency,

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where we can help entertainers and music businesses

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promote themselves online.

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This has been the Cutting Through Podcast.

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Don't forget to subscribe, and we will see you next time.